John Reimann
On the afternoon after the US Senate, under the leadership of Democratic Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer passed the bill to force the railroad workers to keep on working, prohibiting them from going on strike. Oakland socialist talk with railroad worker, Matt Weaver. Matt started by describing what kind of traveled PE railroad workers get

Matt Weaver
On Union Pacific in Norfolk Southern, it was like the first 200 Miles was unpaid for travel floating guys. They were in camp cars up until a pandemic. That was just ridiculous. They’re paying out of pocket for food and gas to be on the road.

John Reimann
Matt explained the whole issue of sick days.

Matt Weaver
Even even with a doctor’s excuse, you get points. But the problem is they have no extra men there. They’re working short. They can’t afford to have people off. The “brokered deal” and Biden came up with, you know, was Tuesday through Thursday, unpaid sick events that had to be scheduled 30 days in advance, not for paid sick days. His his “brokered deal”, I put it in quotes brokered because it’s it’s kind of bullshit, is that it was no pay for three sick events that were Tuesday through Thursday with 30 days notice. That’s not helpful.

John Reimann
The Senate passed, passed this bill mandating you guys not going on strike. And in it, there was a call for additional sick days from one to seven days. But even with that, even with the seven days, it would not have resolved your your issue around that, as I understand it. But in any case that was not in what they passed,

Matt Weaver
There was a separate bill was like an amendment to the bill.

John Reimann
I remember when NAFTA was passed. At that time, there was an article in the Wall Street Journal that reported that – you know, that was NAFTA was very, very unpopular with the unions. And, and in some areas, you know, the unions had a strong influence as far as getting people elected. So a couple of members of Congress sent a letter to Bill Clinton, who was president at that time, saying, “Look, we’re going to vote against NAFTA, unless our votes are needed for the past, in which case we’ll vote for it.” And, to me, that’s kind of like the pattern bargaining that they do, you know, we’ll vote against it, knowing it’s going to go through anyway, or in this case, we’ll vote for it knowing it’s going to fail.

Matt Weaver
To save face and work on reelection.

John Reimann
(We talked about the large number of strikes last October of 2021. And also the tendency of the union leadership to push for contracts that were not satisfactory to the members, and the tendency in a number of cases of the members to vote those contracts down.) So what I’ve seen definitely in my union, and also in others, is that the leadership is how can I put it, they’re trying much too hard to play ball with the employers.

Matt Weaver
Right. I think that’s kind of the way with a business model union, that the game is set and the Railway Labor Act kind of enforces that mantra. It’s very frustrating because there are no politicians who are even talking about twiddling with the RLA you know. It’s made in 1926 law to keep commerce flowing no matter what.

John Reimann
You know, as far as these laws, back prior to the 1930s, it was illegal in many cases, to even get together and talk about a union, because it was considered like unfair to business. Then they couldn’t enforce those laws anymore because of the big militant strikes in the 1930s. So they changed the law. Similarly, in the 1960s, which is when I was coming up, you had all the segregation laws in the south. When they couldn’t enforce those laws anymore, then they changed the laws. And so, I believe that the only way that these laws, the Taft Hartley act, all these sorts of things, the only way they’re going to change is when they become unenforceable.

Matt Weaver
You’re, you’re preaching to the choir.

John Reimann
Is there any sort of thought any sort of mood to just say, “Well, you know, you’re not going to run the railroads because we’re going out on strike no matter what you do”?

Matt Weaver
The only place I see that happening, honestly, is with Railroad Workers United, RW. I was one of their founding members a decade ago. Ron Cannon, Cohen, Ed Michael, John Flanders. It was a wonderful event, cross craft unity. And when I took the job with the BMW II national division, I was asked to step away from the board of RWU because of the conflict with the BLE, RWU erupted Operating Crafts United that was trying to merge the UTM and the BLE, but it was it was, you know… I’ve been preaching cross craft solidarity for 25 years. My best informants for my grievances were engineers, conductors… longshoreman taking pictures of themselves painting a wall and pointing to the paintbrush and smiling. You know, we’d win those grievances we cleaned house with cross craft solidarity.

John Reimann
So do you see any mood to just say The hell with it. We’re gonna go on strike no matter what?

Matt Weaver
A little bit. But I think that membership complacency and apathy are a disease that we have. We don’t have the cure for, it you know, not right now. I mean, that was where the internal organizing was helping with that. But also, there’s a tendency for all of the working class… it’s the American way to live paycheck to paycheck. Who can afford to go on strike? who can? And if it’s a wildcat, you don’t get strike pay either. So it’s an interesting thing. Real labor doesn’t want to go on strike. We want an honest, good faith opponent at the bargaining table. And I don’t believe we got it this round.

John Reimann
Well, I believe that you’ll find an honest, good faith opponent, about the same time as you’ll find a wolf with a vegetarian.

Matt Weaver
Amen, brother. Yeah. It’s campaign finance and lobbying. They are the powerhouse in the American government right now. We can’t compete with that.

John Reimann
Well, we can if we’re organized. And you know, what we were talking about when we first started talking just now is about how there’s been a consistent effort ever since I became a union member, which is 1970… There’s been a consistent effort to wipe out of the collective memory, all the struggles of the past. And when you talk about members being complacent, and stuff, and as you say, it’s not just only in your industry. But I think that’s a byproduct of having wiped out that that memory and having driven out of the unions, in many cases and out of the industry in many cases, having driven out those members who are trying to maintain that memory. Not just in blah, blah, blah talk, but in action. It’s important to figure out how to apply it today.

Matt Weaver
I think the Railway Labor Act and the current form of government prevents that. Taft Hartley prevents (that kind of) union activity and your right to work laws . Go back to 1947 in Florida. What was his name Vance Muse. Crazy racist s.o.b. That’s where right to work came from. And then we overturned right to work in Ohio with Senate Bill Five. We overturned right to work in Missouri. We had 50 guys door knocking for that campaign to overturn it. It worked. I am excited about the thoughts of the AFL CIO working to overturn right to work in Michigan, Michigan’s suddenly blue again, that’s “game on you sons of bitches. Let’s go.”

John Reimann
So to me what’s legal and what’s not legal – You know, basically, it operates by the only law that really is in effect, which is might makes right.

Matt Weaver
Yep. It’s kind of relative. I understand.

John Reimann
So, just wrapping it up: Do you think that that they’re going to be able to shove this agreement down the members throats?

Matt Weaver
I think that’s it. And I don’t want to sound like Chicken Little, Doomsday, but the House and the Senate have spoken. Congress’s made the law. So much for capitalism and democracy when they can shove a contract down your throat. I’d like to promote Railroad Workers United again, railroadworkersunited.org.

John Reimann
I hope that this is not the end of the story. Well, it’s not the end of the story. But we’ll see how, when and where it continues.

Matt Weaver
I think we’re already getting ready for Section Six notices for the next round. I have full faith and in Peter Kennedy, our lead negotiator he has a better title than that. But he is well versed in this and Tom Roth and Rich Edelman to help us make a stand. I do believe that Maintenance Of Way, again leads the way in radical change for real labor bargaining. And we got to keep pushing forward to get members together.